Downlo

desmadres replied to your post: desmadres replied to your link: Oh God, Please…

I don’t disagree with any of that, white working class men are still better off than working class POC, but let’s not forget who the real 1% is

Ohohohoho. I’ve noticed people only bring up the 1% thing when they want to ignore or gloss over the inequities that exist below the 1% line.

I’m tired of white leftist males insisting that women and POC talk about white working class male oppression. Class isn’t the only or most important form of oppression. White males, including working class and poor ones, are still privileged in many ways. This is an intersectional blog. “But what about the white males” will always be an invalid argument here.

desmadres replied to your link: Oh God, Please Don’t Let White Male Victimhood Be the Next Big Social Movement

What about the working class men? I agree that there’s more discrimination against women, but working class men are oppressed and marginalized, too.

That’s derailing. The article is talking about how white men are getting all weepy about their problems now that they’ve lost a tiny bit of privilege, while ignoring the fact that they are ALL (including working class white men) still doing better than the rest of us.

If you really want to hold an oppression olympics, I can think of many other groups that would handily beat out white working class men in terms of oppression. Classism does exist but it is FAR worse for nonwhites and women than it is for white men.

It’s interesting how American liberals who are generally very critical of U.S. military interventions around the globe will suddenly become flag-clutching nationalists when non-Americans dare to use violent rhetoric against the U.S. military.

Let me restate that: when non-Americans merely say they want to see American soldiers and their families tortured to death, U.S. lefties will decide it’s more important to yell at people for being angry than to examine why the anger is there in the first place. But that might require you to acknowledge your own complicity in the brutalities the U.S. military has committed to preserve your freedom, your safety, your interests.

If your lefty principles only extend as far as the U.S. border, then you’re just another Yankee to the rest of the world, no matter what party you vote for or how many radical theorists you read.

thetart:

“I’m confused” is the white girl equivalent of white dudes who demand to play devil’s advocate. You get to air your shittiness in the back end of the sentence, and the person you’re challenging is forced to either treat said shittiness as though it’s an honest inquiry or be cast as abusive for refusing to play along. It’s transparent, and it’s all over my dash every time a white woman wants to give a non-white woman a piece of her small white supremacist mind. Stop pretending it’s not the same old racist trolling, because you aren’t confused about anything.

And suggests someone is trying to bring him down…with his own, unedited remarks.

This is in response to questioning about his recent remarks about welfare and black Americans (“I don’t want to make black people’s lives better by giving them other people’s money.”), Santorum said this:

“I don’t single out on any group of people, that’s one thing I don’t do,” the former Pennsylvania Senator explained to Hannity. “I don’t divide people by group and race and class. I believe that in no people in this country. And I condemn all forms of racism. There’s no one that’s been out here working, as you know, in the inner city, and with people of all different races.”

Santorum added: “I condemn all forms of racism and there’s nobody who has done more as a Republican in the United States Senate to bring African-Americans into the party. Go ask J.C. Watts. Ask Michael Steele. I’ve worked with historically black colleges. I’ve done a ton of stuff. This is just someone trying to cause trouble.”

Knowing you have vast potential to show your ass doesn’t mean you won’t show your ass. It just means that you have to own up the fact you did it to yourself when it happens, rather than shifting the blame elsewhere. Which is also a hard thing to learn to do. It’s especially hard when you see yourself being sympathetic or aligned to the plight of others and you still get called for ass-showing. It makes you want to ask for the “hey, I’m on your side” discount on your ass-tasticness. But just as the rest of the world does not see its highest life crisis as helping the White Male understand his unearned advantages, neither is it required to clap its hands encouragingly when the White Male says “look, I’m helping,” especially when in reality he’s making kind of a mess.

(Source: whatever.scalzi.com)

desperatelyseekingvalentino asked: All I can do is be the open-minded person that I am. I see no color because I am made of so many. I'm sorry that it offends you and your followers. I didn't mean to create anger. I just wanted to say that it's important to have perspective. White people get made fun of, black people get made fun of, hispanic people get made fun of, asian people get made fun of, everyone gets made fun of. It's not race, it's human. If I'm wrong, I'm sorry.

All I can do is be the open-minded person that I am. I see no color because I am made of so many.

Reread that, folks. Besides being condescending to me in particular, those two sentences are a perfect example of the generally twisted ‘logic’ produced by racial privilege.

1) Being multiethnic confers color-blindness….which I’m sure will surprise many of my African American and Latino followers.

2) Enlightened folks are unable to perceive race or racism…This is a patently self-serving way to preserve a comfortable, privileged position on the racial hierarchy. It’s easy to ignore race when your race doesn’t negatively affect your lot in life.

I’m sorry that it offends you and your followers. I didn’t mean to create anger.

Classic non-apology. “I’m sorry you’re offended”, not, “I’m sorry for being offensive.”

I just wanted to say that it’s important to have perspective.

Translation: “it’s important to have my perspective”.

Riddle me this: How can someone who doesn’t even perceive race be able to have any sort of ‘perspective’ on racism?

White people get made fun of, black people get made fun of, hispanic people get made fun of, asian people get made fun of, everyone gets made fun of.

Which would be fine if we were living in a world that isn’t structured by racialized asymmetries of power. But we’re not.

What all your talk of color blindness boils down to is that you don’t want to think about racism because you (as a White person) don’t get to be the hero. In fact, you (as a White person) are the problem. And you believe that your desire not to feel bad about yourself (as a White person) is more important than the need for POC to point out racism when we see it.

Righto.

It’s not race, it’s human.

So if I become as broadminded as you, then racism won’t affect me anymore? Golly

If I’m wrong, I’m sorry.

So I have to prove that you’re wrong before you’ll apologize for being an ass about this? Another non-apology. You’re very good at that.

I think you’ve hit about every major form of derailing in your messages to me. Congratulations! Have a gif!

desperatelyseekingvalentino asked: I'm not offended by Native American costumes and I'm a sixteenth Cherokee. I'm not offended by that sombrero costume and I'm Cuban. I'm not offended by leprechauns and Irish stereotypes and I'm Irish. Do you want me to go on? I think the "race" card is something that is so applicable in so many fights. But Halloween isn't one of them. You can't get so PC that no one can have a voice because there are so many rules about who can and who can't. I'm physically white. I can't change that.

I’m not offended by Native American costumes and I’m a sixteenth Cherokee.

If you were actually Cherokee in any meaningful sense, you wouldn’t have to bring up your great-great-great-great grand-whatever by marriage. This is a White Person Thing that I will never fully understand.

I’m not offended by that sombrero costume and I’m Cuban. I’m not offended by leprechauns and Irish stereotypes and I’m Irish. Do you want me to go on?”

Please do. I’m sure you can find some Jewish and Black blood in there if you look hard enough.

By the way, sombreros are a Mexican thing. Your claim to Cuban heritage seems to be about as solid as your claim to Cherokee heritage.

I think the “race” card is something that is so applicable in so many fights. But Halloween isn’t one of them.

1) Saying, “I think this, therefore it is right” is not a valid argument.

2) ‘The race card’ is a card that White people play, not non-Whites.

3) Who elected you Racism Referee? …Oh yeah, your White privilege did.

You can’t get so PC that no one can have a voice because there are so many rules about who can and who can’t.

1) Pointing out racism and racial privilege is not the same thing as censoring people.

2) What you perceive as ‘rules’ about being ‘PC’ (a weasel term made up by the Right, by the way) is actually about shutting the fuck up and listening to POC when we talk about our experiences with racism. When we tell you to check your privilege, we’re telling you to treat us like human beings. The only ‘rule’ involved in discussions about racism is the Golden Rule.

I’m physically white. I can’t change that.

Poor you. You can check your privilege before sailing into a conversation about racism, though.

desperatelyseekingvalentino asked: Am I not allowed to talk about race then? Because I'm white? Isn't that racism? I'm not offended by french maid costumes, I'm french. I'm not offended by hillbilly costumes with broken teeth, and I'm from the south. I'm not offended by fat costumes and I'm fat. I'm not offended by blonde jokes and I'm blonde. I'm not rampaging through the streets when people dress as Barbie and I'm a feminist. I'm not trying to incite a fight, I love your blog. But what are you trying to achieve?

I’m so glad Derailing for Dummies exists. It’s a great time- and sanity-saver to be able to just post links instead of having to write new responses each time I’m presented by the same old unexamined privilege:

Am I not allowed to talk about race then?

You’re ‘allowed’ to do whatever you want. I’m not the government and I’m not your mommy. This isn’t about freedom of speech. This is about you saying something stupid and getting criticized for it. Criticism isn’t censorship.

Because I’m white? Isn’t that racism?

OK, I’ll admit it: I slapped a gag order on you to prevent you from discussing racism because you’re White. I JUST HATE WHITE PEOPLE SO MUCH!

I’m not offended by french maid costumes, I’m french. I’m not offended by hillbilly costumes with broken teeth, and I’m from the south. I’m not offended by fat costumes and I’m fat. I’m not offended by blonde jokes and I’m blonde. I’m not rampaging through the streets when people dress as Barbie and I’m a feminist.

1) It is fucking hilarious that you bring up French maid outfits as stereotypically French.

2) Historically, blondes have not been persecuted for being blonde. In fact, being blonde has usually conferred all sorts of advantages. That’s why blonde jokes don’t bother you. For every blonde joke there is, there are a thousand more women bleaching their hair.

3) Are you from Appalachia? Did you grow up in a trailer park in West Virginia? I suspect not. The hillbilly thing is more of a class stereotype than a regional stereotype. That’s why hillbilly and redneck costumes don’t bug all southern people.

4) I must be a bad feminist. I can’t recall the last time I rampaged through the streets for any reason, let alone because “people dress as Barbie”.

I’m not trying to incite a fight, I love your blog.

You love the parts that don’t make you uncomfortable.

But what are you trying to achieve?

I’m tempted to answer your question with another question (namely: what are you trying to achieve?), but I know the answer already (to derail and gaslight). So I’ll give you an answer: By talking about race and racism, I’m trying to inform, enlighten, and vent some steam.

Y’know, the wording of that question makes me think that you suspect me of more nefarious purposes…like an anti-White agenda. Which explains you accusing me of being racist toward you for being White.

Look: My discussions about racism are about racism. They are not about making you (as a White person) feel bad. If the latter happens, that’s you putting your shit on me, not me “trying to achieve” something. Not everything is about you!

desperatelyseekingvalentino asked: You're costume campaign post is slightly ridiculous, firstly because it's not like there isn't a plethora of costumes making fun of white people (take the blow-up tourist or the plumber outfits that come with plastic WHITE butts). For the most part I love reading your blog, but I don't think that you can honestly play the race card here. It's just silly. It makes the instances when the race issue is applicable weak. I think your heart is in the right place, but you didn't think this one out.

It’s a beautiful Saturday and I’m not in the mood to deal with your bullshit with anything more than a gif: